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But that 4000m + hit range would hit a truck load of targets in operation linebacker, for example, right? Would it also be possible to have the missile explode if it was, say, 700m away from the target instead of being within proximity fuse range? Do I have to be within proxy fuse range to to blow up? How else could you get a missile to explode 4000 meters away from a target?I would say that I could detonate my warhead at anytime by use of the K3 command. I am probably 100% wrong, and am sorry if this is a complete waste of your time  Most of the Nuclear related switches, and settings of the Volhov, were already discussed earlier. The V-760 missile has no radio proximity fuse, it can be detonated by K3 (command) only. It has only two guidance method, TT and UPR. 
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This makes me wonder how nuclear detonation would look on radar screen. waaaaait.. [non-historical]+[nuclear] = easymode in Vietnam?  ^^ big fat Splash on Screen?! ...then nothing, 'cause of EMP?!  Actually EMP is at lower wavelength than the GHz radars of the SAM's, and has major effect only at high altitude detonations. The Nuclear fireball is actually opaque for the SNR's. (See future Stealth development with plasma cloaking)
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Several questionables about new scenarios (mostly Libya). Hpasp won't probably find time to address that in the sim, but nevertheless...  Volkhov: - RPK lamp does not switch off immediately after missile explosion, does not react even on hitting EKV - a death sentence  - no HARM launches visible on display - c'mon, a Mach 3 object should be somehow visible for our ol' SNR! . - SNR elevation is locked at the start (several deg.) and then, after pressing the UNLOCK button immediately jumps to 0 deg. Neva: - no missiles in Linebacker scenario #1 Krug: Once they jam, they do it all the time (good target in passive mode). I like it. I also like that decimeter wavelength P-40 seems at present somehow immune to HARM . I don't like the HARM shower (in one AAR - accidentally deleted - I have counted no fewer that 191 HARMs launched at me). Considering the cost of a single missile - definitely a bug. A side-observation for all KRUGers shooting at jammers in passive mode: switch PA (manual range input) on while remaining at CU from P-40 - you gonna get periodical range updates from P-40 and quite accurate launch envelope calculation. I understand that the jamming visible only when SNR transmits (me-on-when-you-on-too ) is a feature of modern jamming pods, got used to that Is it so exactly in real life? Could you consider a separate button for transmitter on-off? I feel handicapped against real Volkhov FCO who is able to dedicate one hand to Q screen and at the same time observe effects on A/Z screen. Does this new C button in Vega launch officer panel mean "S-for-Special" - in the context of your new nuclear works?
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But that 4000m + hit range would hit a truck load of targets in operation linebacker, for example, right? Would it also be possible to have the missile explode if it was, say, 700m away from the target instead of being within proximity fuse range? Do I have to be within proxy fuse range to to blow up? How else could you get a missile to explode 4000 meters away from a target?I would say that I could detonate my warhead at anytime by use of the K3 command. I am probably 100% wrong, and am sorry if this is a complete waste of your time Most of the Nuclear related switches, and settings of the Volhov, were already discussed earlier. The V-760 missile has no radio proximity fuse, it can be detonated by K3 (command) only. It has only two guidance method, TT and UPR. Right, thanks.
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Volkhov - RPK lamp
- it goes automatically ON when you switch to "75" km mode and have "combat mode" - no matter about shooting
--- HOWEVER - My question: When I am in "combat mode" AND "150" km and switch RPK ON manually then when I switch it off it is still ON.
(Now in Libya mission I am using switching to "training mode" to turn off RPK.)
Last edited by PN79; 04/10/12 02:03 PM.
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Hi Hpasp,
I downloaded this simulator after reading about it on another forum and I have found myself spending more time using your simulator than any of the others I own. I have learned quite a few things about Soviet-era surface-to-air systems that I did not know before. You have done a wonderful job with this simulator, kudos to you.
I have a quick question regarding the 2K11 Krug, is radar burn through modeled with it? Based on some information available from �http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-Engagement-Fire-Control.html#mozTocId657277� the Pat Hand radar has a peak power rating of 750-kW which is comparable to the peak power rating for the Fan Song radar associated with the Divna. If all other factors are consistent, then radar burn through for both these systems should be equal.
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Talking to me? Tovarish Vintorez uses only 35 km mode, no shooting beyond that. Good hint with this FK, anyway. Have observed the same with non-extinguishable RPK lamp. Hpasp, does wide-beam / LORO difference have some effect on reduced HARM vulnerability? Have you modeled something like this? I know that the difference isn't huge - when shooting at LORO I still can observe multiple HARM launches at me from various USN-folks after I launch my pencil Or, is it RPK that still atracts HARMs?
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Volkhov:
- RPK lamp does not switch off immediately after missile explosion, does not react even on hitting EKV - a death sentence
- no HARM launches visible on display - c'mon, a Mach 3 object should be somehow visible for our ol' SNR! .
- SNR elevation is locked at the start (several deg.) and then, after pressing the UNLOCK button immediately jumps to 0 deg.
- RPK is indicating that missile-guidance commands are generated, it works without missile at all and probably must stop imediately only after hiting "Vozvrat"... - when SEAD aircraft launches HARM, it sparks for the moment thru noise jamming. - this is some strange bug, it appears only when starting missions one after another, without exiting completely from the SIM...
Last edited by piston79; 04/10/12 08:08 PM.
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Also, some of the switches on a few systems do not get "reset" when running back to back missions.
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I have been doing some thinking about the "manual explosion switch" (RAB. po K3 I�III red indicator on) that sends the K3 command to the missile once it reaches the range bore-sight. Wouldn't this be a solution to my Kurg missiles not exploding when near, not dead on, the SR-71. However, the manual makes no note of such a switch in the SA-4B like the SA-2B (and maybe even the sa-3b, which, for some reason, I have never been able to properly learn). Is there such a proximity charge mode?
The only two mentions of the proximity fuse in the manual is the k9 command, which simply arms it, and the Sh.P. switch which simply arms the fuse after the launch to maximize finding potential.
Also, is that the only two proximity fuse modes?
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My "at least something" result with S-125 in Libya scenario:
Notes:
- First HARM was launched when I tried to acquire target through SNR.
- My first two missiles were aborted immediately after launch.
2:00am 15th of April, 1986.
Operation El-Dorado Canyon raid against Benghazi.
Targets:
Jamahiriyah barracks - 6 A-6E Intruder (from the CV-66 USS America)
Benghazi AFB - 6 A-6E Intruder (from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
Supporting force:
8 SEAD F/A-18A Hornet (VMFA-314 Black Knights, VMFA-323 Death Rattlers from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
2 SEAD A-7E Corsair-II (VA-46 Clansmen, VA-72 Blue Hawks from the CV-66 USS America)
6 CAP F/A-18A Hornet (VFA-131 Wildcats, VFA-132 Privateers from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
3 ECM EA-6B Prowler (VAQ-135 Rooks, VMAQ-2 Playboys from both carriers)
1 SIGINT EA-3B Skywarrior (VQ-2 Sandeman from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
2 AWACS E-2C Hawkeye (VAW-127 Seabats from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
S-125M1 Neva
27:45, P-15 knocked out by HARM.
00:01:08, F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-314 Black Knights launched AGM-88 HARM missile.
00:02:27, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 20km
Target azimuth: 295�
Target elevation: 1�
Target altitude: 592m
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:02:33, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-2
Target distance: 20km
Target azimuth: 295�
Target elevation: 1�
Target altitude: 592m
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:02:55, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 20km
Target azimuth: 295�
Target elevation: 1�
Target altitude: 691m
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:03:01, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-2
Target distance: 18km
Target azimuth: 295�
Target elevation: 2�
Target altitude: 647m
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:03:08, F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-314 Black Knights launched AGM-88 HARM missile.
00:03:26, Missile exploded on Channel-2
F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-314 Black Knights hit by SAM. (miss distance: 97m)
00:03:28, SNR knocked out by HARM.
Total, SNR On Air Time: 1min 12sec
Last edited by PN79; 04/11/12 10:45 PM.
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Few observations about S-125 in Libya scenario: - acquiring targets is not too hard - preset SNR with altitude and approximate range and azimuth data about target from plotting board then just do short search in azimuth (transmitter ON just for few seconds) - ignore targets not displayed in plotting board due to unknown altitude (SNR can not be preset) - once you find target correct your targeting by quick lock and then immediatelly turn off transmitter - then correct range through expected data about its altitude - done this right and it will give you approximative position of target - if target is still too far away it is necessary to sometimes turn on transmitter for correction - especially when target change its bearing - once expected that it is in range shoot only one missile against it in TT mode (if you do not achieve burn through) - once missile hits target or passes its expected range or just randomly explode immediatelly turn of transmitter and do not activate it for at least 30 seconds or more - be sure that HARM was launched - pray for its miss - shooting with two missiles is suicidal (too much time on air) Anyway my best result was one destroyed F/A-18 and another damaged - and I was still hit by HARM.
2:00am 15th of April, 1986.
Operation El-Dorado Canyon raid against Benghazi.
Targets:
Jamahiriyah barracks - 6 A-6E Intruder (from the CV-66 USS America)
Benghazi AFB - 6 A-6E Intruder (from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
Supporting force:
8 SEAD F/A-18A Hornet (VMFA-314 Black Knights, VMFA-323 Death Rattlers from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
2 SEAD A-7E Corsair-II (VA-46 Clansmen, VA-72 Blue Hawks from the CV-66 USS America)
6 CAP F/A-18A Hornet (VFA-131 Wildcats, VFA-132 Privateers from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
3 ECM EA-6B Prowler (VAQ-135 Rooks, VMAQ-2 Playboys from both carriers)
1 SIGINT EA-3B Skywarrior (VQ-2 Sandeman from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
2 AWACS E-2C Hawkeye (VAW-127 Seabats from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
S-125M1 Neva
15:14, P-15 knocked out by HARM.
00:01:19, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 19km
Target azimuth: 313�
Target elevation: 2�
Target altitude: 988m
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:01:29, F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-314 Black Knights launched AGM-88 HARM missile.
00:01:41, Missile exploded on Channel-1
F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-314 Black Knights killed by SAM. (miss distance: 1m)
00:03:45, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 11km
Target azimuth: 320�
Target elevation: 6�
Target altitude: 1,2km
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:04:15, A-6E Intruder No.1 (from the CV-66 USS America) bombed Jamahiriyah barracks.
00:04:16, A-6E Intruder No.1 (from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea) bombed Benghazi AFB.
00:04:47, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-2
Target distance: 15km
Target azimuth: 324�
Target elevation: 4�
Target altitude: 1,2km
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:04:58, F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-323 Death Rattlers launched AGM-88 HARM missile.
00:05:00, Missile exploded on Channel-2
F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-323 Death Rattlers hit by SAM. (miss distance: 106m)
00:05:01, A-6E Intruder No.2 (from the CV-66 USS America) bombed Jamahiriyah barracks.
00:05:02, A-6E Intruder No.2 (from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea) bombed Benghazi AFB.
00:05:04, SNR knocked out by HARM.
Total, SNR On Air Time: 1min 30sec
Last edited by PN79; 04/12/12 10:54 AM.
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PN79 - thank you for the tips! 
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Another quriosity...(First missile hits, no mather of jamming...  Hmmm, it could be a bug.
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Several questionables about new scenarios (mostly Libya). Hpasp won't probably find time to address that in the sim, but nevertheless... Volkhov: - RPK lamp does not switch off immediately after missile explosion, does not react even on hitting EKV - a death sentence - no HARM launches visible on display - c'mon, a Mach 3 object should be somehow visible for our ol' SNR! . - SNR elevation is locked at the start (several deg.) and then, after pressing the UNLOCK button immediately jumps to 0 deg. Neva: - no missiles in Linebacker scenario #1 Krug: Once they jam, they do it all the time (good target in passive mode). I like it. I also like that decimeter wavelength P-40 seems at present somehow immune to HARM . I don't like the HARM shower (in one AAR - accidentally deleted - I have counted no fewer that 191 HARMs launched at me). Considering the cost of a single missile - definitely a bug. A side-observation for all KRUGers shooting at jammers in passive mode: switch PA (manual range input) on while remaining at CU from P-40 - you gonna get periodical range updates from P-40 and quite accurate launch envelope calculation. I understand that the jamming visible only when SNR transmits (me-on-when-you-on-too ) is a feature of modern jamming pods, got used to that Is it so exactly in real life? Could you consider a separate button for transmitter on-off? I feel handicapped against real Volkhov FCO who is able to dedicate one hand to Q screen and at the same time observe effects on A/Z screen. Does this new C button in Vega launch officer panel mean "S-for-Special" - in the context of your new nuclear works? RPK has a strange behavior, but Im not sure if it is intentional. (Should be checked in manuals, but I have no time for that...) Hungarian FCO's used to switch the system into the BR just before any missile launch, and switched back to KC after detonation. HARM should be visible on SNR and acquisition radars. (It might be hidden behind jamming.) SNR elevation should not be 0. Do you switch H<5? Missiles should be available in Linebacker. Bug. P-40 was historically avoided to be hit by HARMs. Special is for Special 
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Hi Hpasp,
I downloaded this simulator after reading about it on another forum and I have found myself spending more time using your simulator than any of the others I own. I have learned quite a few things about Soviet-era surface-to-air systems that I did not know before. You have done a wonderful job with this simulator, kudos to you.
I have a quick question regarding the 2K11 Krug, is radar burn through modeled with it? Based on some information available from �http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-Engagement-Fire-Control.html#mozTocId657277� the Pat Hand radar has a peak power rating of 750-kW which is comparable to the peak power rating for the Fan Song radar associated with the Divna. If all other factors are consistent, then radar burn through for both these systems should be equal.
Not modeled. Actually the whole Burn-Through part of the code should be revised, as it based on the Dvina, and not taking in consideration the SNR type.
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Talking to me? Tovarish Vintorez uses only 35 km mode, no shooting beyond that. Good hint with this FK, anyway. Have observed the same with non-extinguishable RPK lamp. Hpasp, does wide-beam / LORO difference have some effect on reduced HARM vulnerability? Have you modeled something like this? I know that the difference isn't huge - when shooting at LORO I still can observe multiple HARM launches at me from various USN-folks after I launch my pencil Or, is it RPK that still atracts HARMs? Zoltan Dani not (illuminated) and shot at ANY target beyond 20km. When you hit High Voltage + ANT, you are visible, independently of the SNR mode. If RPK is emitting, you are visible.
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I have been doing some thinking about the "manual explosion switch" (RAB. po K3 I�III red indicator on) that sends the K3 command to the missile once it reaches the range bore-sight. Wouldn't this be a solution to my Kurg missiles not exploding when near, not dead on, the SR-71. However, the manual makes no note of such a switch in the SA-4B like the SA-2B (and maybe even the sa-3b, which, for some reason, I have never been able to properly learn). Is there such a proximity charge mode?
The only two mentions of the proximity fuse in the manual is the k9 command, which simply arms it, and the Sh.P. switch which simply arms the fuse after the launch to maximize finding potential.
Also, is that the only two proximity fuse modes? Detonate missile on Command ( K3) was developed for the early SAM systems (Dvina/Volhov/Neva) in the fear of US would jam the Radio Proxy fuse to detonate the missiles prematurely. Meanwhile, the US was afraid to jam the Proxy, as it would detonate those missiles also, that would otherwise avoid the target, so they never jammed it. In later SAM systems, this feature was omitted.
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Few observations about S-125 in Libya scenario: - acquiring targets is not too hard - preset SNR with altitude and approximate range and azimuth data about target from plotting board then just do short search in azimuth (transmitter ON just for few seconds) - ignore targets not displayed in plotting board due to unknown altitude (SNR can not be preset) - once you find target correct your targeting by quick lock and then immediatelly turn off transmitter - then correct range through expected data about its altitude - done this right and it will give you approximative position of target - if target is still too far away it is necessary to sometimes turn on transmitter for correction - especially when target change its bearing - once expected that it is in range shoot only one missile against it in TT mode (if you do not achieve burn through) - once missile hits target or passes its expected range or just randomly explode immediatelly turn of transmitter and do not activate it for at least 30 seconds or more - be sure that HARM was launched - pray for its miss - shooting with two missiles is suicidal (too much time on air) Anyway my best result was one destroyed F/A-18 and another damaged - and I was still hit by HARM.
2:00am 15th of April, 1986.
Operation El-Dorado Canyon raid against Benghazi.
Targets:
Jamahiriyah barracks - 6 A-6E Intruder (from the CV-66 USS America)
Benghazi AFB - 6 A-6E Intruder (from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
Supporting force:
8 SEAD F/A-18A Hornet (VMFA-314 Black Knights, VMFA-323 Death Rattlers from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
2 SEAD A-7E Corsair-II (VA-46 Clansmen, VA-72 Blue Hawks from the CV-66 USS America)
6 CAP F/A-18A Hornet (VFA-131 Wildcats, VFA-132 Privateers from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
3 ECM EA-6B Prowler (VAQ-135 Rooks, VMAQ-2 Playboys from both carriers)
1 SIGINT EA-3B Skywarrior (VQ-2 Sandeman from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
2 AWACS E-2C Hawkeye (VAW-127 Seabats from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea)
S-125M1 Neva
15:14, P-15 knocked out by HARM.
00:01:19, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 19km
Target azimuth: 313�
Target elevation: 2�
Target altitude: 988m
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:01:29, F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-314 Black Knights launched AGM-88 HARM missile.
00:01:41, Missile exploded on Channel-1
F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-314 Black Knights killed by SAM. (miss distance: 1m)
00:03:45, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 11km
Target azimuth: 320�
Target elevation: 6�
Target altitude: 1,2km
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:04:15, A-6E Intruder No.1 (from the CV-66 USS America) bombed Jamahiriyah barracks.
00:04:16, A-6E Intruder No.1 (from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea) bombed Benghazi AFB.
00:04:47, V601P 5V27U Missile launched on Channel-2
Target distance: 15km
Target azimuth: 324�
Target elevation: 4�
Target altitude: 1,2km
Missile guidance method: TT (Three Point)
00:04:58, F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-323 Death Rattlers launched AGM-88 HARM missile.
00:05:00, Missile exploded on Channel-2
F/A-18A Hornet, VMFA-323 Death Rattlers hit by SAM. (miss distance: 106m)
00:05:01, A-6E Intruder No.2 (from the CV-66 USS America) bombed Jamahiriyah barracks.
00:05:02, A-6E Intruder No.2 (from the CV-43 USS Coral Sea) bombed Benghazi AFB.
00:05:04, SNR knocked out by HARM.
Total, SNR On Air Time: 1min 30sec
Another wisdom (written by blood) of survival from Serbia... After an engagement never start another, otherwise you will be killed like...4.rd / 250.rbr PVO at Dolovo (started 2nd engagement) 2.rd / 450.rp PVO at Ljubic (was on air for 42sec) 3.rd / 450.rp PVO at Becej (was on air for 43sec) You-> <-Weasel
Last edited by Hpasp; 04/12/12 04:45 PM.
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Zoltan Dani not (illuminated) and shot at ANY target beyond 20km. Yep, but with "Volkhov" (and V-755 range comparable with AGM-88 range) we can bring down a SEAD on quite long distanse, and then have enough time to cover (at least at the SIM). Now AGM-88 doesn't allow such bravery (This is from: http://www.designation-systems.net/dusrm/m-88.html, but this is for the last version of the HARM): The latest upgrade effort for HARM is known as Block VI, an international collaboration by the U.S. (Raytheon), Germany (BGT), and Italy (Alenia). The main improvement of HARM Block VI is the incorporation of a GPS navigation systemAbout short range combats - my bitter expirience! : FACEPALM! Another wisdom (written by blood) of survival from Serbia...
After an engagement never start another, otherwise you will be killed like...
Mmmm... Libya became very boring!
Last edited by piston79; 04/12/12 05:12 PM.
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HOA's
by Terl9999 - 09/18/26 04:12 AM
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Football
by Terl9999 - 09/18/26 02:42 AM
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Flags
by Terl9999 - 09/15/26 10:03 PM
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