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Hello, pilots,

I'm currently rewriting my old joystick-setup (adding multiplayer-functionality) and have a question concerning the multiplayer-mode's targeting-functions.

This is the list of the available targeting-functions that I already had mapped except the italic part, with the part that I don't really understand yet marked in bold.

How exactly do I use these functions ("SHF d" and "d") in MP? Simply pressing "d" like in SP is not sufficient to lock my view on the closest foe in MP? Do I have to press "SHF d" to select the closest foe already lock my view on it, or do I then have to press "d" as well?

Any help appreciated - I'd like to rather sooner than later join you online - and THX in advance,
Ulf

Shift D allows you to key on a particular plane of your choice regardless if that plane is friend or foe. Its main benefit is in big furballs when your target (friend or foe) can get lost easily.

To use it, find the plane you wish to keep track of via N, F or E. Once you have locked onto that plane via one of these keys you can then press "SHIFT D". This will be the plane you will be able to recall when you hit "D". Should this plane get killed or you get too far away from it the lock will be broken.

This feature does not work in SINGLE PLAYER. It only works in the MULTI PLAYER. The "M" and "T" keys will not work in multi player but will in single player.

Word of advice for multiplayer...stay high, keep your speed up and don't attack against more than 2 vs 1 or you'll die quickly. Most of the guys playing RB3D now have been doing it for years and are very good.

For the germans fly the D7 or the Dr1. German planes have less of a learning curve than allied planes do. If you fly allied try the N28, Snipe or Spad 13 first...just don't try and turn fight in a Spad. Most MMP use the Intermediate FM because Authentic FM has "issues".

THX for your reply - now I can finish my setup.

One point that's not really clear for me is this "t" in MP: according to the manual it locks the view on the last plane that has shot at you; now I would understand this as meaning that as long as you haven't been 'pinged' there's nobody you could lock on - prolly your SA's just too good to be surprised like this and that's why you never could lock via "t"...? So, does it just work differently in SP and MP, or doesn't it work in MP at all and the manual's wrong in this point?

BTW, what kind of "issues" does the 'authentic' FM have? I've never bothered to fly with anything else, so I'm really curious as to why others would wanna cose the 'intermediate' setting?

Salute, DonULFonso!

I can't speak for everybody's experience with the "SHF+D" function in MMP, but I found that I can only get it to work by following these steps in sequence:

1) target the plane you want to lock onto. (NOTE: I don't use "SHF+D" to lock onto enemies. I use it to lock onto my wingman so I can locate him quickly during combat.)

2) hit the "F8" key (target view).

3) hit "SHF+D".

Your target is now locked to the "D" key.

It sounds like you're new to MMP...welcome aboard! RB3D's on-line community is probably the friendliest and most helpful you'll find. You really should check out our main website at Wings of Valor . That's really the primary "watering hole" for all of the MMP pilots and squadrons.

OK, shameless plug time:

While you're there, be sure to download my MMP tutorial available in Adobe .pdf format. It will take you step-by-step through everything you need to know about flying RB3D on-line. It will shorten your learning curve by many months.

You'll find it in the "Documents" section under LW_Dumbo's MMP Tutorial. (NOTE: I recently changed my call-sign. I called myself "Herr Mac" when I wrote it.)

While you're there, be sure to check out WWSensei's tutorial on energy management (he's an ex-fighter jock in real life!) and RAF_PepeLePeu's stuff, too.

Hope to see you in the cyber skies real soon.

Good luck, and good hunting!

Salute, DonULFonso!

In SP, the "T" key will slew your padlock to the closest threat. In MMP, the "T" key slews your padlock to whomever put the last bullet into your plane. It's a similar concept to SP...I only use it in MMP when I'm locked in combat with one bandit only to hear bullets hitting my plane from behind. Then, I use the "T" key to see who's on my tail.

As for "Authentic" vs. "Intermediate"...well, I've always used "Intermediate" in SP because, believe it or not, the AI pilots are more aggressive in this mode. Also, NFM (Normal Flight Model) is the most common FM you'll find on all of the MMP servers because there's less tendency for planes to "uber" when damaged. (Again, read my tutorial). AFM (Advanced Flight Model) servers are out there, but not as many.

NFM is closer to SP's "Intermediate" mode, while AFM is closer to SP's "Authentic" mode.

THX for your reply ! Together with the info gathered on WoV it now shouldn't be any problem for me to optimize my setup.

Do I need to switch to the target cam via "F8" each time I want to lock another target via "SHF d"? If so, I'd better assign the complete sequence "F8 SHF d" instead of only "SHF d"...

Yes, you need to switch to the "F8" view each time you want to lock onto a new target.

To be honest, I don't even have the "SHF+D" function mapped to my joystick anymore...since I only use it for locking my wingman.

Read my tutorial. In it, I have a whole section devoted to dogfighting and key functions. To maintain my "SA" (situational awareness) during combat, I rely solely on the "F3," "E," and "F2" keys.

(I talk about the "F2" key in a revised version of the tutorial that Chevelle hasn't posted yet. "F2" works in MMP the same way that it does in SP--i.e., it will slew your padlock to the last object you had padlocked, whether that was an air or ground target. Very useful.)

THX, Dumbo, for this clarification.

I guess I won't assign the complete sequence, though, 'cause the common way would be to identify via "F8" prior to locking it anyway. Due to the view-system I've set up for my stick such a "sequenced" function would be more pain to program than gain worth this effort - maybe later...

I am pretty sure that you don't need to be in F8 view. Will check it tonight.

Gidday Don, I am a big fan of your logical programming for the Cougar.

I have used your tips and owe you a few, so if I can be of any help drop me a line at the squad sig below. If you need help going online I would be glad to oblige.

THX for your reply .

This in fact would be pretty important for me to know! At the moment I have coded it this way that I only "allow" to lock on a target via "SHiFt d" if you're currently in the "F8" target-to-you view - this restriction wouldn't be necessary (and wouldn't make sense, either ) if I needn't hit "F8" before being able to lock.

THX for the flowers ...

If you'd just find out online whether "F8" is required or not, then this would help - rather: enable - me to finish my Cougar set-up (and later convert it for the SWF22, probably)!

BTW, the reason why I'm modifying my old set-up is that someone had asked me for a README (never had done any), and while I was on it, I thought "why not optimize it a lil' here and there"... and ended up re-writing it from scratch :rolleyes: 'cause I had to realize that I didn't know zilch about MMP.

If you could give my "finals" a go online before I'll release 'em on Cougar World, then this would be great!

The reason why I'd "need" someone to test 'em simply is that I haven't used the official soft- and firmware since quite a while , and I wouldn't wanna downgrade "just" to test 'em (too much hassle to uninstall the BETAs and reinstall the official 2.04 package and clear and reflash etc., just to roll back once the testing's done).

...?

Really looking forward to flying RB online - for the 1st time ! I've just registered for your forum, but I guess that I won't be able to fly often enough to actually apply for your squad...

Salute! Don,
I can confirm that you do not need to be in the enemy F8 view. Simply hitting E, then Sft_D will lock it.

I would be happy to test your profile for you.
Would you believe that I just broke one of the springs in the Cougar??!!! It's an IJ U-2 Mod. It just snapped in the middle of a dogfight and scared the beejesus out of me. The funny thing was I was taking a few lead pellets at the time. I didn't last long. Wait till I tell IJ.

I would be happy to take you online. No strings attached. Being in Australia it may be hard to get a time but any of the *AA* would be happy to show you the ropes.

email me at:-
poyungan(at)accessplus.com.au

~E!~
D_T

Salute, poyungan!

It's quite possible that this never worked for me because of my old joystick...a Logitech WingMan Extreme Digital 3D. When I couldn't get it to work way back when, a squadmate of mine told me about this "work-around," and I've been doing it that way for five years lol!

Now that I've got a shiny new CH joystick/pedal set-up, I'm going to try not using the "F8" and see if it works for me now.

Isn't it funny how we all get into routines?

Well, poyungan, interesting that according to your test you don't need to be in "F8"s target-view 'cause that's what the docs I could find did say. It would be even more interesting to know whether this applies only if the current target has been selected as "e"nemy, or whether this applies generally, i.e. cycling through "n"ext target or "f"riendly or "t"reat etc. as well.

Anyway, gents, for the time being I've set up my stick to only allow to lock a target for "D"ogfight if you're currently in "F8"s target-view - if so, then holding Hat2Up (remember that HAT2 is the "T"arget "M"anagement "S"witch in the "real deal" ) for a lil' time will lock the current target for "D"ogfighting, if not, then that very same Hat2Up being depressed for that same lil' while selects an "o"bject that's in the boresight; just quickly "tapping", i.e. /Pressing and immediatly /Releasing, Hat2Up padlocks on the target you've selected the way described above.

My "problem" is that I don't wanna spread the targeting-functions over more than one single coolie , so I guess I'll leave it this way - can't do no harm to 1st identify a target before locking it anyway ...

But it sure would be interesting to know whether "F8"s target view is a "must" or just a... erm , "routine" (no pun intended , Dumbo).

Sometimes in the middle of a furball I will hit "T" to find out who hit me, or just to tag them, then shft-D lock them, deal with whoever is the most likely threat then come back to the other guy with "D" (if I am lucky enough to live). No need for the F8 here either. Why? It is a matter of prioritising who you need to keep an eye on. If there an Ace around you want to know exactly where he is. If you take a few pellets in the meantime the "T" will shift to the last guy who hit you.

The reason why it is handy to F8 before locking is to confirm who it is. There is no need to lock on the new guy taking a Moraine Bullet for a spin but if one of the Topguns is in a N28 diving down with both barrels smoking, you want to know where he is.

Yep. I am the wrong guy to speak to about this stuff. Talk to my hand. The thumb does all the work and I just look at the screen

P.S. I emailed IJ about the broken spring at eleven oclock last night and he sent replacements in the mornings post. The guy is all class.

OK, THX for clearifying that "F8" is not required prior to saving a target for "D"ogfight.

Since thus there's no need for me to "link" those 2 functions any longer (as I had assumed), I'd like to ask you for your comments on the following 2 alternatives of possible solutions for the "T"arget "M"anagement "S"witch (the Cougar's HAT2).

Both alternatives use the horizontal "axis" (Hat2Left/Right) to cycle through "f"riends (Left) or "e"nemies (Right).

The more "essential" axis however is the vertical "axis" (Hat2Up/Down) to padlock (and save) the target for "d"ogfight (Up) respectively the current "t"reat (Down) if just "tapped" quickly. If held longer, this "axis" Down position can be used to padlock a "l"andmark. Alternatve 1 has the boresight "o"bject padlock implemented at this "axis" Up position, alternative 2 not; there, Up padlocks the "n"ext plane.

The only difference between both alternatives is whether to use HAT2's Up or Down position to padlock the "n"ext plane. Since Left and Right padlock on "f"riends and "e"nemies, both alternatives "make sense" - the question is, which way is "more intuitive": alternative 1 with Up like "pointing away over the nose" (of the plane)" to padlock a boresight "o"bject, similar to Down (like "down towards the ground") padlocking a "l"andmark, or alternative 2 with Up to padlock the "n"ext plane 'cause this direction could be considered the "main position" of this coolie. Personally, I prefer alternative 1 'cause this mapping matches my "standard" for any sim and I wouldn't wanna learn a new mapping if there ain't enough good reasons for it .

1st some notes on how to "read" my scheme (I won't confuse ya with the coding ), though:
Please note that I've included the "m"ember padlock in my schemes although it's only available in SP. The reason simply is that both set-ups, SP and MP, share the same general layout and handling, with "SP only" functions not being set up in the MP set-up and vice versa. The "(too) complete" schemes are just meant to give you an impression.

Alternative 1:
Alternative 2:
Whaddaya think?

It'll be the 1st version, then - no comments from others so far, so I'll follow my own taste :rolleyes: .

The coding's done (for both SP and MP), the README'll be next to do, and maybe - mind: maybe - I'll (find someone to ) make an IMAGE for Foxy as well...

Don,
Sorry I saw this too late to comment.
I would offer the observation that the N key is one of the most frequently pushed keys for those who want to keep an eye on their SA.
The time it takes for a plane to dive from N key range to E or F range is pretty short. I like to tap it as often as I can. It make sense to map it to an easy option.

I actually used a little routine that went something like ...N (pause),F8, N (pause), F8,..(Rpt)
This was to stop me having to tap the button so often. As soon as a contact was made the screen shifted as soon as it cam into E/F range. I guess my thumb is so fit now it doesn't need it.

"M"ember will not work in multiplay.
Some others you may wish to map are:-
Alt-T....transparent cockpit.
Alt_I...Gives a handy turn and bank, pitch overlay.
Sft-N...displays Names
Sft-M...toggles Regular, Incendary and Tracer ammo.
KP 5...displays map.

Isn't Hat2Down easy enough ? Hat2Up may be even more easy to use :rolleyes: , but then again I'd hate to lose "o"bject-padlock - and since it's a boresight-padlock this gotta be mapped to up if mapped. Hat2Down, then, given you don't manage to convince me that flying without "o"bject padlock is better flying - mind: in SP as well! [edit] But I'll think it over Äcause Up sure is more comfortable to hold with your thumb (trained or not)... [/edit]

Your thumb's fit, fine: just hold Hat2Down and keep holding it to 'automatically' send a "n"ext plane padlock command each 3/4s - no need to repeatedly tap it again and again (but you can still do so if you wish to :rolleyes: )!

That's a general thing: forget your "routines"! You've got a HOTAS - you don't need to use your keyboard any more, and you don't need to accept anything RB3D itself or your old Logitech Wingman or MS Sidewinder or whatever forced you to! As long as you can do some via keyboard and mouse and stick you can program your HOTAS to do what you want - just wait and see ... In the meantime: say "goodbye" to your routines... [edit] But do tell me about 'em - it is important for me to know what you're doing now to be able to optimize my set-up![/edit]

I know, that's what I've explained in the note for the snippets :p ...

"ALT t" and "SHiFt m" of course are mapped (yep: to easy options), but I've skipped "ALT i" and "SHiFt n" 'cause such one-time toggles can rather be hit manually, i.e. on the keyboard - they're not essential enough to be mapped to the stick, IMHO. Or do I have to use "SHiFt n" more than just once to turn labels on?

But what's this "KP5 displays map" stuff? AFAIK KP5 is "look 90° straight up", not "map" ("kneepad" would be KP0, BTW)...?

Wish me the nerves to overcome yet another modification :rolleyes: of my set-up:

Your comment on the way you use(d) to scan for bandits 'inspired' me 'cause I really like this idea - now I'll try to implement some sort of 'semi-automatic' function to continuously output the according "n F8"-sequence once each second as long as you hold the paddle-switch S4 while pressing Hat2Up (yep, I'm gonna change this, too ), supposed you're currently in the external camera view.

The reason why S4's the one to trigger this 'linked' "scan/ID"-function is that S4 is used to "reverse the camera direction" in the external camera view already - hence it's 'just' :rolleyes: a matter of 'linking' a 'PULSEd' AKA /Auto-repeating "F8" if S4 is held while in the external camera view.

Like I said: wish me the nerves ...

P.S.: Please don't hesitate to answer my la(te)st questions, though ...

Done - generally , that is, with some tweaking still to do :rolleyes: ...